Fluoro...again

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Scattergun2570
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Fluoro...again

Postby Scattergun2570 » Wed Apr 05, 2017 9:47 am

I am interested in fishing for Trout instead of Bass for once.. I have had a zillion suggestions about what leader material to run,,and I am no closer to choosing one. I used Seaguar Blue Label at the beggining of my Bass fishing career,before I knew it wasn`t required. I used to look at it when it went under water,and it was tough to see.. I figured it would be ok for Lakers and Browns in NY Reservoirs.. My mistake was to ask in a Trout forum...and cloud my thoughts with 9 different Fluoro carbon lines.One guy suggested Seaguar STS Trout & Salmon,,which is wayyyy cheaper than the Blue Label....but Seaguar has Red Label and many others! What is the difference between all their lines? I plan on running 8lb test,,to throw Crankbaits,,Crocodiles Daredevils,,etc.. I may live live some Sawbellies or Minnows as well. Some help please!
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slime king
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Re: Fluoro...again

Postby slime king » Thu Apr 06, 2017 3:07 am

I have had best luck with Gamma leader material. I get it through fish usa on the south shore of lake erie. It's a tough floro leader material that is slightly thicker than competitors and priced decent.

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Randingo
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Re: Fluoro...again

Postby Randingo » Fri Apr 07, 2017 11:40 am

If you're only talking about using it as a leader attached to (I assume) braid, I wouldn't worry too much about cost because you're not going to be using much of it at any time. I'm inclined to suggest getting Tatsu in whatever sizes you want and calling it quits. It's extremely well behaved and has great knot strength. If there's something particular that you're looking for in a leader material for trout, you could consider that there was a recent extensive shootout of trout tippet materials for fly fishing, and Trout Hunter fluorocarbon earned top marks. I'll see if I can find the article if you're interested.

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Re: Fluoro...again

Postby Scattergun2570 » Fri Apr 07, 2017 5:06 pm

Randingo wrote:If you're only talking about using it as a leader attached to (I assume) braid, I wouldn't worry too much about cost because you're not going to be using much of it at any time. I'm inclined to suggest getting Tatsu in whatever sizes you want and calling it quits. It's extremely well behaved and has great knot strength. If there's something particular that you're looking for in a leader material for trout, you could consider that there was a recent extensive shootout of trout tippet materials for fly fishing, and Trout Hunter fluorocarbon earned top marks. I'll see if I can find the article if you're interested.


Well sure,,would like to read it... all I am concerned with is trout shying away from seeing line...if they are really line shy..I am skeptical,but the trout guys assure me I should be using fluoro.
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Re: Fluoro...again

Postby Randingo » Sat Apr 08, 2017 1:04 am

Necessary? Not unless you're fishing a New Zealand trout stream that looks like it's filled with bottled water... And even then, not really necessary. Will it help you catch a few more fish than a mono leader? On rare occasions. If you're fishing braid, you will catch more fish with a leader--either mono or fluoro-- than without. If you're really concerned about the fish being line shy, fluoro is slightly less visible than mono. You don't NEED to sweat about the differences between different products unless you want to. Just don't throw straight braid.

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Re: Fluoro...again

Postby Scattergun2570 » Sun Apr 09, 2017 1:14 pm

Randingo wrote:Necessary? Not unless you're fishing a New Zealand trout stream that looks like it's filled with bottled water... And even then, not really necessary. Will it help you catch a few more fish than a mono leader? On rare occasions. If you're fishing braid, you will catch more fish with a leader--either mono or fluoro-- than without. If you're really concerned about the fish being line shy, fluoro is slightly less visible than mono. You don't NEED to sweat about the differences between different products unless you want to. Just don't throw straight braid.



Truthfully...I don`t believe any of the hype about fluoro,for any species.. I use P-Line CXX for all my Bass outings,works very well no matter where I go. I just figure maybe Trout are different..but I was going to use 8lb test P-Line CXX,,before I spoke to the Trout people.
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Re: Fluoro...again

Postby Randingo » Mon Apr 10, 2017 4:19 am

There's an easy way to do this: go fishing with the P-Line. My concern with CXX is that it's among the thickest and stiffest monos out there, which may negatively impact certain presentations, but you've apparently fished it successfully for quite a while, so it should be fine. If you want to see if something lighter and limper will make a difference, pick up a spool of 3X mono tippet material and attach several feet to your CXX. If you do better with that, then think about whether you want to try a fluoro leader.

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Re: Fluoro...again

Postby Scattergun2570 » Mon Apr 10, 2017 6:21 am

Randingo wrote:There's an easy way to do this: go fishing with the P-Line. My concern with CXX is that it's among the thickest and stiffest monos out there, which may negatively impact certain presentations, but you've apparently fished it successfully for quite a while, so it should be fine. If you want to see if something lighter and limper will make a difference, pick up a spool of 3X mono tippet material and attach several feet to your CXX. If you do better with that, then think about whether you want to try a fluoro leader.


You referred to cxx as mono,,it's Co Poly isn't it? Yes CXX is stiff,,but in 8lb test? Not so stiff...but really,,all I want to know is if Trout can really be turned off by line visibility..I don't mind buying some Seaguar Blue Label it deemed necessary.Like I mentioned,,I never fish for Trout,,so I don't know.
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Re: Fluoro...again

Postby Randingo » Mon Apr 10, 2017 6:52 am

Semantics. CoPoly IS mono; not all mono is CoPoly. CXX 8 is as thick as most brands' 10 or even 12. If you look at a line that's accurately rated like Sunline Supernatural, it's the same diameter as 14#. I don't think you'll notice a huge difference from mono leader material to fluoro in terms of number of bites, but I'll bet the number goes way up if attach 3X tippet to your CXX. If that improves your bite percentage, then think of trying the fluoro. My comments are based on the minimal difference I see between mono and fluoro leaders when fly fishing for trout. There are a few places where the difference is a little more pronounced, but not many.

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Re: Fluoro...again

Postby Scattergun2570 » Mon Apr 10, 2017 10:20 am

Randingo wrote:Semantics. CoPoly IS mono; not all mono is CoPoly. CXX 8 is as thick as most brands' 10 or even 12. If you look at a line that's accurately rated like Sunline Supernatural, it's the same diameter as 14#. I don't think you'll notice a huge difference from mono leader material to fluoro in terms of number of bites, but I'll bet the number goes way up if attach 3X tippet to your CXX. If that improves your bite percentage, then think of trying the fluoro. My comments are based on the minimal difference I see between mono and fluoro leaders when fly fishing for trout. There are a few places where the difference is a little more pronounced, but not many.



I just realized that I did not indicate that I use braid with a leader,and the leader material is CXX. Now,,can you explain what 3X tippet is? oh yes,,by the way,, I will be throwing crocodiles,and traps,and cranks..no bait available yet.
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Re: Fluoro...again

Postby Randingo » Mon Apr 10, 2017 12:57 pm

Tippet material is mono or fluoro designed to be the end of the leader that attaches to your fly in fly fishing. They are labeled using a weird, archaic system, but what you need to know about it is 3X tippet is .008 inches in diameter, 5X tippet is .006, and 2X is .009. So tippet material is sold by diameter, not breaking strength. One brand's 3X might be rated to break at 7 pounds, while another breaks at 8.5. I keep mentioning tippet material and the "X rating system" because mono or fluoro rated this way is pretty much purpose designed for fly fishing for trout. It has properties designed to aid in delicate presentations. So I've been focusing on 3X because it is truly 8# test and much thinner and softer than P-Line CXX. You can buy a 25 yd spool for about $5, whereas a spool of fluoro tippet material will cost about $15. So if you're trying to figure out if the properties of the line are going to matter when you're trout fishing, you can experiment with mono (copolymer) for 5 bucks to see if it works better in those situations than your standard CXX. I'm just thinking this is the most cost effective and convenient way of testing for yourself if it makes a difference, and a spool is tiny and flat, and it slides in a pocket so easily that you won't even notice.

Here's a link to a good trout leader material. If you surf around a little, you'll see that they carry six or seven different brands and many of those brands offer several options in mono plus fluorocarbon tippet materials. I'm hoping to just simplify the process of trying a leader material that's designed specifically for trout fishing without a lot of messing around. I honestly think that if you're going to see an improvement, the major improvement in catching trout will come from going to a thinner, limper leader material, not from switching to fluoro, and this will hopefully be a cheap and easy way to find out.
https://www.feather-craft.com/wecs.php?store=feacraft&action=display&target=GF001

Scattergun2570
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Re: Fluoro...again

Postby Scattergun2570 » Mon Apr 10, 2017 4:06 pm

Randingo wrote:Tippet material is mono or fluoro designed to be the end of the leader that attaches to your fly in fly fishing. They are labeled using a weird, archaic system, but what you need to know about it is 3X tippet is .008 inches in diameter, 5X tippet is .006, and 2X is .009. So tippet material is sold by diameter, not breaking strength. One brand's 3X might be rated to break at 7 pounds, while another breaks at 8.5. I keep mentioning tippet material and the "X rating system" because mono or fluoro rated this way is pretty much purpose designed for fly fishing for trout. It has properties designed to aid in delicate presentations. So I've been focusing on 3X because it is truly 8# test and much thinner and softer than P-Line CXX. You can buy a 25 yd spool for about $5, whereas a spool of fluoro tippet material will cost about $15. So if you're trying to figure out if the properties of the line are going to matter when you're trout fishing, you can experiment with mono (copolymer) for 5 bucks to see if it works better in those situations than your standard CXX. I'm just thinking this is the most cost effective and convenient way of testing for yourself if it makes a difference, and a spool is tiny and flat, and it slides in a pocket so easily that you won't even notice.

Here's a link to a good trout leader material. If you surf around a little, you'll see that they carry six or seven different brands and many of those brands offer several options in mono plus fluorocarbon tippet materials. I'm hoping to just simplify the process of trying a leader material that's designed specifically for trout fishing without a lot of messing around. I honestly think that if you're going to see an improvement, the major improvement in catching trout will come from going to a thinner, limper leader material, not from switching to fluoro, and this will hopefully be a cheap and easy way to find out.
https://www.feather-craft.com/wecs.php?store=feacraft&action=display&target=GF001


Maybe fluoro isn't a bad idea..I hear it's more abrasion resistant than mono...
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Re: Fluoro...again

Postby angry john » Tue Apr 11, 2017 10:25 am

I caught a lot of trout while fishing in WA on regular Berkeley XL in 6lbs. I also used sniper and a few others. The water is very clear in most of the ponds and streams up there and to be honest i got just as many on the nylon as i did on the way more expensive flouro. I did not use it as a leader in either case but as a main line. I found that the trout i was fishing for were more sensitive to diameter than material. If i went above 6 my catch rate went way down and below 6 it did not seem to improve my numbers so i just stuck with 6.

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Re: Fluoro...again

Postby Scattergun2570 » Tue Apr 11, 2017 12:38 pm

angry john wrote:I caught a lot of trout while fishing in WA on regular Berkeley XL in 6lbs. I also used sniper and a few others. The water is very clear in most of the ponds and streams up there and to be honest i got just as many on the nylon as i did on the way more expensive flouro. I did not use it as a leader in either case but as a main line. I found that the trout i was fishing for were more sensitive to diameter than material. If i went above 6 my catch rate went way down and below 6 it did not seem to improve my numbers so i just stuck with 6.



Did you ever get break offs from Teeth?
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angry john
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Re: Fluoro...again

Postby angry john » Wed Apr 12, 2017 10:55 am

no never had that issue at all. I mostly fished cranks so they did not take them all the way down. The dropshot and wacky rigs got a lot and never had issues there either. Big steelies would be different.


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